Editor Findings
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Half TrueBarack Obama recently claimed that construction workers are "paying a higher tax rate than somebody pulling in $50 million a year." He was speaking at a DNC event on Sep. 26 in West Hollywood, CA - and made similar statements in several other recent speeches (see 'More Info').
To find out if this claim is true, we invited the Truthsquad community to fact-check the president's statement as part of this month's pilot. Between September 28th and October 12th, 2011, 43 different members participated in this truthsquad. Together, we reviewed dozens of factual documents from multiple, credible sources reporting on this topic (see links to the right).
The factual evidence we found suggests that the answer varies greatly depending on the individuals involved, and whether or not they pay taxes on wages or on investment income, or both. In a number of cases we reviewed, construction workers earning $50,000 per year pay lower effective tax rates than people making $50 million a year -- but we also found a number of cases when middle-class workers in the same bracket pay higher taxes than these multi-millionaires. This was a difficult claim to fact-check because the U.S. tax code is extremely complicated, with a variety of different rates, and some key data are still missing (e.g.: nobody seems to know the exact percentage of millionaires who pay a lower effective tax rate than middle-class families).
On the whole, we could only find partial support for President Obama's generalization that it’s common for a construction worker to pay a higher effective tax rate than someone earning $50 million a year. The facts suggest a much more nuanced answer, as people who make most of their money in wages pay taxes at a higher rate, while those who get most of their income from investments pay at lower rates -- but we don't know in what proportions.
Based on these results, we find this claim HALF TRUE.
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Community Findings
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Fabrice Florin
Half TrueAs I wrote in the editors finding, the factual evidence we found together suggests that the answer varies greatly depending on the individuals involved, and whether or not they pay taxes on wages or on investment income, or both. On the whole, we could only find partial support for President Obama's sweeping generalization. The facts suggest a much more nuanced answer, as people who make most of their money in wages pay taxes at a higher rate, while those who get most of their income from investments pay at lower rates -- but nobody seems to know the exact proportions between these two groups. Even Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner was unable to estimate the number of millionaires who pay taxes at a lower rate than middle-income families. Hence my finding of "Half-True," which is confirmed by trusted sources like PolitiFact and most members who did extensive research on this topic. Thank you all for participating in this fascinating experiment! -
Kristin Gorski
Half TrueI've read articles that address different claims about tax rates and teachers making $50,000 a year. They mention the above quotation but don't dispute it directly. There is enough evidence, based on the articles I've read linked from this page, however, to say that it is partially correct. This quotation needs much more of a detailed explanation to make it informative and 100% true. -
Patricia L'Herrou
Half Truein reading the articles in politifact (on each end of this) and in factcheck on rates, the statement seems based upon two given individual examples and therefore cannot be used as a generalization, which more generally would probably be more false than true according to the tax rates for those levels except when capital gains are involved. so, in finding the facts, it would be important to include real information about the bottom line rates actually paid by each category given the abilities to deduct for many types of exemptions, and to point out that the historical point of progressive taxes is that those making so much more are intended to pay more to make the responsibility for a democratic government fair. it would also be good to have pointed out examples of what happens to those peoples governed by countries in which taxes and incomes have not been kept in balance. -
Ellen Miller
Half TrueSorry. But I just don't have the time to dig into this. Can the fact checking process be simplified? Will have to be if you expect/want wide use! -
Mike Carlson
TrueWhile the marginal rate may be higher for the million-a-year-aire. Those with high discretionary funds can take advantage of the exceptions to the rule that pepper our tax cose. Removing the exceptions and flattening the tax will result in a more fair system and more revenues. -
Louise Auerhahn
True(I would rate it a 4.5 for vagueness, but the scale only allows whole numbers.) The statement is by nature a generalization; it does not claim that *every* construction worker pays a lower aggregate rate than *every* person with income of $50 million. There can be exceptions (for example, a construction worker who is unemployed much of the year would pay a very low tax rate), but in general, this is true, due to the low capital gains tax combined with the numerous loopholes, deduction and other means for the wealthy to avoid paying taxes on their full income. -
Carlos R. Candelaria
Mostly TrueThis a complicated question.The tax code is so convoluted that it's hard to do all the research necessary.But I'll keep plugging away and do the best I can. -
J. B. Van Wely
True'Construction workers' covers a broad spectrum. Indeed.com says their average salary is $47,000, but heavy equipment operators can make $100,000, while non-union laborers make $20,000. Disregarding the current payroll tax discount, everybody pays 15.3% payroll taxes (FICA, Medicare) on the first $106,000 in salary, 2.9% on everything after that (no cap on Medicare). Saying the employer pays half is just noise. It all comes out of the cost of an employee, and would go into salary otherwise (as is the case for employer-paid health care). Most construction workers will fall into the 15% marginal tax bracket ($17,201 – $69,800), while most $50m+ earners will fall into the 39.6% marginal tax bracket (over $383,350). BUT that applies only to salaried income. Most $50m+ earners make most of their money from capital gains and dividends, which are taxed at 15%. So a $50m+ who's taking it all in salary will pay about 40% in federal taxes. An operating engineer (that's a heavy equipment operator) will pay about 30%. BUT it will be difficult to find a 50m+ who's taking even 20% of his (and it probably won't be 'her') earnings in salary. With a mix of $10m in salary and $40m in capital gains and dividends, the 50m+ is paying around 20% total. To add insult to injury, every $100 of tax deduction is worth $39.60 to the 50m+, but only $15.00 to the construction worker. So, while we can find cases at opposite ends of the curve where the construction worker pays a higher rate than the 5m+ earner, the assertion is by and large true. -
Michael Shaver
Politi-fact does a great job breaking down this argument. Just like any other tax argument it all depends where you're getting your numbers, there is certainly potential for this to be true and therefore like Bob said it's good politics. I also posted the transcript of Pres. Obama's remarks while he was in Cincinnati. I am neutral on whether it's true or false – the right people and circumstances can sway this in either direction, after all no one ever said life was fair. -
Doug Greer
TrueIt depends on how the wealthy person is acquiring the money. If say Warren Buffet makes $50 million dollars in a year on capital gains he only pays about 15% in taxes. People who do actual work, like a construction worker pays about double in payroll taxes... http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/09/warren-buffett-gave-his-tax-return-to-charlie-rose-last-month.php -
Christoph Wienands
Half TrueThanks to G.W. Bush, the tax rate on dividends and long-term capital gains is 15% whereas regular income taxes are much higher. If you're a multi-millionaire, chances are most of your income does not come from salary but from dividends and capital gains. Compared to a construction worker, millionaires and billionaires likely still pay more because depending on the family situation, a construction worker might pay close to zero $ in taxes. However, at the core Obama's message is true, namely that multi-millionaires often pay less taxes than let's say upper middle class families (100k and up?). -
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Sarah Mason
Half TrueAfter reviewing the links provided, it appears, generally speaking, that the tax rate increases the more you earn. One link states, "An analysis by the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center projects that for 2011, households with more than $1 million in income will have an average federal tax rate of 29.1%, compared to a rate of about 12.4% for households with income of $40,000 to $50,000"(Obama Calls for New Taxes on Wealthy). There are very slight deviations in the numbers depending on what source you use, but overall this is consistent data. However, as pointed out by Warren Buffet, many of the nation's wealthiest individuals rely on interest or capital gains income, rather than payroll income which are apparently only taxed at 15%. If these individuals have little payroll income, it is possible for them to have a lower tax rate than the top 1% (Stop Coddling the Super-Rich). This 15% rate is obviously closer to the amount paid by a teacher or construction worker. In conclusion, it depends on the individual and the situation. Some individuals earning over $50 million dollars may have a lower tax rate. It depends on the type of income they have accrued that year, the number of deductions they are eligible for, and various other factors. For this reason, I believe President Obama's statement to only be half true. -
Walter Frick
Half TrueAs many others have noted, it depends. I looked at multiple pieces on similar claims by Factcheck and Politifact, as well as from Paul Krugman and others. If the millioinaire in question makes most of his or her income via capital gains, then it's going to be true. If their income is via salary, then it would not be. -
Jack Dinkmeyer
FalseAlthough Politifact stated the difficulty measuring taxes one-to-one, generally Obama's statement is false. -
Bob W Vermeers
Mostly TrueThe argument that the mega-rich pay a higher tax rate than those with a modest income is based a lot on the fact that the actual tax is on the adjusted gross income (after donations to charities, non profits, and non political entities). This doesn't alter the fact that the rate they pay in income taxes is much less than the modest wage earner (who can not afford to make comparable donations). I have one other source of information printed in the July 19/26, 2010 (double issue) of "The Nation" magazine; which has as its theme "Inequality in America and What to do About it". Robert Reich's piece is the most illuminating because it tracks the record of the economy relative to the concentration of wealth in the top 1% of Americans. This isn't a game of numbers. Mr. Reich lists a causal relationship. The disparity in tax rates only exacerbates the problem and makes the spiraling down of the economy inevitable if we don't reverse it. -
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Albert N. Milliron
Half TrueI agree with other reviewers. The claim is based on examples that seem to fit the desired outcome of the presenter. There are examples that are correct on both sides. The Buffet claim compares apples and oranges and with all due respect to Buffet, he could pay a higher tax rate anytime he wished. DC math is amazing. The points seem clear on the surface until you dig a bit. Reminds me of profiles on a dating site.... -
Patricia W. Neal
TrueYes they are if one includes the regressive Payroll taxes and Sales Taxes. In addition the $ 50 Million a year earner is probably not on a salary or hourly wage, but gets the bulk or all of that $ 50 million from Capital Gains. -
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Donald Barnes
Mostly TrueThis is simple. All one need consider is the disparity between current diminished taxes on capital gains vs the tax rates for other taxable income. I and I believe the capital gains tax rate is about fifteen per cent (15%) and the tax rate for taxable income above about forty thousand dollars ($40,000) is above fifteen per cent (15%). So, generally, if the taxable income of constructions workers is above forty thousands dollars ($40,000) they are taxed at a greater rate than taxpayer whose income is considered as capital gains for tax purposes. -
jejaru sharma
Half Truemaybe, that's generally true, but he is using a "ratehoric" which sometimes misleads. -
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Sheng Chen
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Charlie Graham Twin-c
Mostly TrueTwin-c Vanilla Spilla "Barry Soetoro aka Barack OBAMABLOWUP!" Ft. JOHN F. KENNEDY http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdMymDv6Db4 -
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JoshC
TrueTax "rates" are not the issue. Lack of tax policy and long term economic vision are very much. What counts as income? What is the true burden (taxes) on that income: income tax, state taxes, excise taxes, sales taxes, federal, state and local fees? The "rich" don't make the bulk of their income in "salary." Who out there is pulling in a $50 Million salary? Are corporations people? (According to current law they are!) If so, are corporate "people" paying lower tax rates than worker people? What does a "person" (corporate or worker) need to exist -- food, housing, education(sic), etc? -
Ed Fraser
FalseThere are two facts not in dispute: (1) The progressive INCOME tax system means higher INCOMES pay higher INCOME tax rates. (2) Everybody pays the same capital gains tax rate of 15%. The IRS defines income as that which appears on a Form W2 that is issued to employees to document annual income, to which income tax rates then apply. New business creation has a simpler equation, they're either profitable or they're not. If a business is profitable they pay 15%. It seems Obama proposes to increase capital gains tax rate on new business investment in order to stick it to the Buffets of the world. An indisputable axiom of taxation is: what ever gets taxed, we get less of. Do we want less new business investment in the middle of this economy? -
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Rashid Mehmood
TRUE http://www.usatrends.us/2011/09/target-on-wallace-as-costa-rica-edges-u-s-in-california/ -
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Jassica
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Look for verifiable facts about this claim.Try to check at least three different sources.
SUPPORT (6)
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Remarks by the President on Economic Growth and Deficit Reduction
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Stop Coddling the Super-Rich
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Living Within Our Means and Investing in the Future
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Barbara Boxer says 400 richest taxpayers saw incomes grow by 400 percent, tax rates fall by 40 percent
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Buffett's words twisted on taxes
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The Need for the "Buffett Rule": How Millionaire Investors Pay a Lower Rate than Middle-Class Workers
OPPOSE (3)
NEUTRAL (16)
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Warren Buffett says the super-rich pay lower tax rates than others
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Historical Effective Federal Tax Rates for All Households
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Obama Rejects Obamaism
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Fact Check: Are rich taxed less than secretaries?
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SOI Tax Stats - Individual Income Tax Rates and Tax Shares
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U.S. Federal Individual Income Tax Rates History
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Does a secretary pay higher taxes than a millionaire?
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Obama, taxes and the ‘Buffett Rule’
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Barack Obama says construction workers pay higher tax rate than someone earning $50 million a year
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Remarks by the President on the American Jobs Act -- Cincinnati, OH
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Progressivity in United States income tax
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Tax Facts
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FactCheck: Obama wrong on teachers' tax rate - ABC News
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Democratandchronicle - FactCheck: Obama wrong on teachers' tax rate
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Progressive Economists Refute AP, Defend The Buffett Rule | Media Matters for America
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Here's What The Wall Street Protesters Are So Angry About...




COMMENTS (6)